Hi all,

With the recent upgrade of the forum software, the mechanism to determine which posts are new for each user has also been changed or rather enhanced. I would like to hear the democrate vote off the members on this so please choose your favorite option after reading the explaination below.

The majority vote wins, even it means reverting the forum back to the previous mechanism. The poll will stay open until 31st March.


Theory:

The forum can operate in one of the following three manners:

Inactivity/Cookie Based - once a user has been inactive for a certain amount of time (ie 15 mins) all threads and forums are considered read. Individual threads are marked as read within a session via cookies. This option is how all versions of vBulletin before 3.5 functioned.
Database (no automatic forum marking) - this option uses the database to store thread and forum read times. This allows accurate read markers to be kept indefinitely. However, in order for a forum to be marked read when all threads are read, the user must view the list of threads for that forum. This option is more space and processor intensive than inactivity-based marking.
Database (automatic forum marking) - this option is the same as a previous option, but forums are automatically marked as read when the last new thread is read. This is the most usable option for end users, but most processor intensive.

Before the upgrade only the first option was available. Now we have switched to the third option which presents each user with an individually tailored list of which posts are new/unread, not just since your last visit but overall.


Practice:

Let's illustrate with an example of how what the main consequences are from switching to cookie-based to database-tracked tracking.

First, how would the screen of new posts look like before (using the View New Posts since Last Visit link):


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Then secondly, the next picture shows how a selection of new posts might look with database-tracking (using the All Unread Posts link):


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You will notice that the second screen shows the same information as the first but adds to that all other threads for which a user still has unread posts.


Questions:

Question: When using database tracking: how does the forum know when a thread should be marked as 'read'?
Answer: Either by the user reading all posts in the thread or by the user marking the thread as read using the Mark Forums As Read option. This marking can be done either on a global forum level (for all sub forums) or one individual forum.

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Question: When using database tracking: will posts that I have not read be kept indefinatively in status 'unread'?
Answer: No. All your unread posts will be marked as 'read' 60 days after they have been published.


Related threads


UPGRADE: forum upgraded to vbulletin v3.5.3
What's New / Since ...
"View new posts" guts
New Threads: ## | New Posts: ##
New threads suggestion
Number of New Threads

I voted for the old way based solely on being able to see all messages since last visit. This is the way I used to keep up with the board. That way, I could choose not to read a post and it wouldn't show up the next time. The current way lists all unread posts even if I had seen them before but chose not to read them. If the new way wins, I won't be disappointed however.

Like Steve I voted for the old way, but it really does not matter to me. Usually I read the ones I want to read and then mark everything read.

It's silly, but i wish i could turn on the 'New' way for the forums I care about and the 'Old' way for the rest of the site.

Dave

The new way is far better from my point of view.

With the old way there were many times where the session went stale due to my having to answer urgent calls and/or fix problems but not wishing to log off.

How about an extended trial period to give everyone a bit of time to get used to the new ways before reverting.

Terry

Terry,

This is exactly one of the big advantages of the database-tracking method. I have intentions of changing the current mechanism until 31/03 but we could extend that period of course.

I also voted for the old way, for when I enter baanboard, I want to see all new posts since last visit. The new method shows unread posts from previous visits also.

The big advantage of course of the new method is when I start looking at the new posts, get interrupted, CLOSE the window, and then later log on to the site again. But if it's choosing one or another, I still prefer the older method.

Regards,
En

Pat

One problem is that only 23 of the 1000's of users have voted.

Very pleased that you will reserve your judgement for a while yet.

Thanks again for your efforts.

Terry

Terry,

Yes I also would like to obtain a larger population of votes. The poll still runs until 31th March so there will definatively be no change before then.

The new way is far better from my point of view.

With the old way there were many times where the session went stale due to my having to answer urgent calls and/or fix problems but not wishing to log off.

I totally agree!

I voted for the old way, because I want to see all new posts since last visit.

Regards,
Jovan

I think some people are still missing the point: with the new tracking you can still see 'new posts since last visit'...

The most effective way to check baanboard for new unread posts is to bookmark the following link in your browser:

http://www.baanboard.com/baanboard/search.php?do=getnew

(works only when cookies are accepted and properly stored)

I prefer the new way.

Is there a way to exclude certain forums?

e.g. for me, I would prefer not to see "recruitment" and non-English forums.

apologies if this information is available on the board, but I couldn't find it if it is.


Ed

Ed,

Yes but only in a 'unsupported' way. You have to construct the URL to the New Posts yourself, e.g.:

http://www.baanboard.com/baanboard/search.php?do=getnew&exclude=10,38,65,66,67,68,69,74 (http://www.baanboard.com/baanboard/search.php?do=getnew&exclude=10,38,65,66,67,68,69,74)

Where the numbers behind the exclude parameter are the ID's of the forums you want to exclude. You can find the ID of a forum by hovering over its title on the homepage.

We have passed the deadline of 31st of Match and the vote has ended in a tie (24-24). So I am going to keep the poll alive for another 2 months. The "new posts" mechanism will stay as it is for the moment.

Thank you Patrick.

I would have been dissappointed to loose the 'new' feature. At least we all have more time to get used to it.

Is it possible to have the vote weighted by the number of times people actually log on over the review period. This would give a much better indication of the true feeling. For example: those who log on 5, 6 and more times a week would have more weight than casual users who log on only now and again.

Considering the number of registered users on this board I think it is a very poor show that so few have voted. If I were the boardmaster I would be very dissappointed that users did not respond to the request for an opinion/information.

It would be a shame to select the approach that is less popular on the basis of the vote by casual users.

Terry

I was one of the first to vote. I voted for the old way, but said I wouldn't be disappointed either way. After getting used to the new way, I would be in favor of the new way. I don't see a way to switch my vote however.

Maybe it's a bug, but one thing kills me about the new way.

If I've read the latest thread in a forum and someone responds to an older
post. The Latest post shows up on the main screen as having activity. when really it doesn't.

If that didn't happen, i'd be a lot more into the new way.

Dave

I was one of the first to vote. I voted for the old way, but said I wouldn't be disappointed either way. After getting used to the new way, I would be in favor of the new way. I don't see a way to switch my vote however.

Steve, that is not possible unfortunately.

Maybe it's a bug, but one thing kills me about the new way.

If I've read the latest thread in a forum and someone responds to an older
post. The Latest post shows up on the main screen as having activity. when really it doesn't.

If that didn't happen, i'd be a lot more into the new way.

Dave

Dave,

I am not following on this one. Can you visualize this? When you say the 'main screen', are you referring to the homepage? or?

on the main forum index.
http://www.baanboard.com/baanboard/index.php

For example, in the Tech forum. the latest post is
AUDIT_MAX_ROWS

it showed up as bold yesterday, after i had read the thread
because one of the other threads in that forum had a new post
to it.

When you click on the forum, the AUDIT_MAX_ROWS is not bold
but the ones below it are....

I'll get a screenshot the next time I see it.

Dave

Not sure how to do attachments.. let's see if this works.

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Well, thta's really small. but i think if you click on it you can see what i'm talking about.

Dave

From your snap shot I would say you read the first thread and have not read the other threads. I thought they stayed bold until you read them. The thread at the top indicates the latest activity and that you read the thread. Or so I thought.

I also would change my vote at this time.

Dave,

OK I understand now. Mark was right: you have to distinguish between the sort order of the posts (which is on most recent date) and the "not yet read" highlighting. With the new tracking it is perfectly possible that a thread of several weeks ago will still be shown to you in bold even though it is not even visible anymore on the first page list. The only way to make it 'un-bold' is either to read it or to make all posts read.

Right - so i'm not going to change my vote to the new way :)